What does anyone think of this brand? copycat? wannabe? etc...

I love some Lexuses, but not all, they try to much to be Normal car and Sportscar
they dont chose to build one kind

Copycat/Wannabe Mercedes Benz

hmm yeah your right
Lexus
http://www.car-data.com/photos.25/p.lexus.sc430.25.jpg

Mercedes
http://www.bbbsmorriscounty.org/graphics/Mercedes.jpg

Just neutral...
Objectively they are very good cars but I don't think I'd ever buy one... I'd go for sth German in their category.

I'm neutral about it. They are ok. I agree with jimkk29, I'd go with the Germans :D

Copycat/Wannabe Mercedes Benz

EXACTLY, all I like is the IS300.

Oh come on, the cars that Dutch put up are both convertables, and that's all they have in common. Seriously, just look at 'em. The only reason that a few Lexus look like some Mercedes is that they are designed for direct competition with the Mercedes counterparts. You gotta admit the LS series for a while looked more like what it was, an upgraded Camry. The SC 400's are damn original as well as powerul sports coupes. the New SC's are as well! I don't care what anyone says, the 98'-'00 GS400 had killer style all it's own. V-8 RWD on the GS and SC for not as much money as their German counterparts. That' Japanese value againg showing it's permiance! I will admit they look similar to Mercedes now, but only more so than any other car line. Does that make Lexus a bad car company? Freak no! :evil:

Oh come on, the cars that Dutch put up are both convertables, and that's all they have in common. Seriously, just look at 'em. The only reason that a few Lexus look like some Mercedes is that they are designed for direct competition with the Mercedes counterparts. You gotta admit the LS series for a while looked more like what it was, an upgraded Camry. The SC 400's are damn original as well as powerul sports coupes. the New SC's are as well! I don't care what anyone says, the 98'-'00 GS400 had killer style all it's own. V-8 RWD on the GS and SC for not as much money as their German counterparts. That' Japanese value againg showing it's permiance! I will admit they look similar to Mercedes now, but only more so than any other car line. Does that make Lexus a bad car company? Freak no! :evil:

Lots of us don't like them, so what....They are copycat cars....I'll take a Q45 or a LS anyday.

Oh come on, the cars that Dutch put up are both convertables, and that's all they have in common. Seriously, just look at 'em. The only reason that a few Lexus look like some Mercedes is that they are designed for direct competition with the Mercedes counterparts. You gotta admit the LS series for a while looked more like what it was, an upgraded Camry. The SC 400's are damn original as well as powerul sports coupes. the New SC's are as well! I don't care what anyone says, the 98'-'00 GS400 had killer style all it's own. V-8 RWD on the GS and SC for not as much money as their German counterparts. That' Japanese value againg showing it's permiance! I will admit they look similar to Mercedes now, but only more so than any other car line. Does that make Lexus a bad car company? Freak no! :evil:

well said.... :D

you've gotta remember a lot of these people are european so they have not had a true lexus experience. If you are going to compare an SC430 with an SLK thats pretty dam sad they aren't even in the same price category

lexus or toyota will never accomplish what mercedes has.
MBZ baby
8)

The only reason that a few Lexus look like some Mercedes is that they are designed for direct competition with the Mercedes counterparts
I don't think any serious car company would design a car to look like another so it could be competitive. Both Audi and BMW are direct competition to Mercedes but they dont design cars that they look like a Mercedes. Admit it, both Toyota and Lexus don't know to design cars.

The only reason that a few Lexus look like some Mercedes is that they are designed for direct competition with the Mercedes counterparts
I don't think any serious car company would design a car to look like another so it could be competitive. Both Audi and BMW are direct competition to Mercedes but they dont design cars that they look like a Mercedes. Admit it, both Toyota and Lexus don't know to design cars.

well, those are prestegious european automakers, and they really know how to design those kinds of cars, but toyota only knows how to design cars that aren't as expensive, so when they want to appeal to buyers that are used to buying a car that looks european, they make it look european; and what other way to do it, than "borrow" from mercedes :)

The only reason that a few Lexus look like some Mercedes is that they are designed for direct competition with the Mercedes counterparts
I don't think any serious car company would design a car to look like another so it could be competitive. Both Audi and BMW are direct competition to Mercedes but they dont design cars that they look like a Mercedes. Admit it, both Toyota and Lexus don't know to design cars.

well, those are prestegious european automakers, and they really know how to design those kinds of cars, but toyota only knows how to design cars that aren't as expensive, so when they want to appeal to buyers that are used to buying a car that looks european, they make it look european; and what other way to do it, than "borrow" from mercedes :)

Lexus' problem is they "borrow" TO MUCH, esp on the LS.

Infiniti and Lexus are competing with one another and usually yes, the Lexus will be sold more because of better warrenties and infamous Toyota quality. I'd take an SC 400, IS 300, and GS 400 any day of the week. Same goes for the M45 and G35 from Infiniti. Excellent cars that all hold thier own as far as I can see. Sure, I'd take a Q45 over the Ls too, but the other ones are alot more debateable.

The only reason that a few Lexus look like some Mercedes is that they are designed for direct competition with the Mercedes counterparts
I don't think any serious car company would design a car to look like another so it could be competitive. Both Audi and BMW are direct competition to Mercedes but they dont design cars that they look like a Mercedes. Admit it, both Toyota and Lexus don't know to design cars.

well, those are prestegious european automakers, and they really know how to design those kinds of cars, but toyota only knows how to design cars that aren't as expensive, so when they want to appeal to buyers that are used to buying a car that looks european, they make it look european; and what other way to do it, than "borrow" from mercedes :)

Lexus' problem is they "borrow" TO MUCH, esp on the LS.

Would you care to list what they borrow? I really would like to be enligtened

The only reason that a few Lexus look like some Mercedes is that they are designed for direct competition with the Mercedes counterparts
I don't think any serious car company would design a car to look like another so it could be competitive. Both Audi and BMW are direct competition to Mercedes but they dont design cars that they look like a Mercedes. Admit it, both Toyota and Lexus don't know to design cars.

well, those are prestegious european automakers, and they really know how to design those kinds of cars, but toyota only knows how to design cars that aren't as expensive, so when they want to appeal to buyers that are used to buying a car that looks european, they make it look european; and what other way to do it, than "borrow" from mercedes :)

Lexus' problem is they "borrow" TO MUCH, esp on the LS.

Would you care to list what they borrow? I really would like to be enligtened

Ummm STYLING....look at a LS and a big Benz...MB threated Lexus with a lawsuit it was so bad.

personally I like Lexus. Very good solid cars, and they are even better than some Germans. Benz is not very reliable, although it is a sweet car and i love them. Lexus has better all around reliability and performance, ILL take TWO!!

The only reason that a few Lexus look like some Mercedes is that they are designed for direct competition with the Mercedes counterparts
I don't think any serious car company would design a car to look like another so it could be competitive. Both Audi and BMW are direct competition to Mercedes but they dont design cars that they look like a Mercedes. Admit it, both Toyota and Lexus don't know to design cars.

well, those are prestegious european automakers, and they really know how to design those kinds of cars, but toyota only knows how to design cars that aren't as expensive, so when they want to appeal to buyers that are used to buying a car that looks european, they make it look european; and what other way to do it, than "borrow" from mercedes :)

Lexus' problem is they "borrow" TO MUCH, esp on the LS.

Would you care to list what they borrow? I really would like to be enligtened

Ummm STYLING....look at a LS and a big Benz...MB threated Lexus with a lawsuit it was so bad.

LOL thats really far fetched you have any proof of this lawsuit? and the only major thing that the lexus looks a last generation Mercedes is the tail lights and how they were shaped, and the front of the S class looks nothing like that of an S

lawsuits go up for a lot of stupid things..... :roll:

styling is the main thing, but hummer sued some company for copying the H2 styling, but that was some REAL similarity

also, think about this.... :)

MB E430
4.3L engine
275 HP

Lexus LS 430
4.3L engine
290/300 (in SC430, GS430)

I think the IS 300 and 2006 GS 430 are cool.

mb called lexus a dressed up toyota back in 89. I think somewhere between 97 and now Lexus passed MB up in total US sales for the bland sedans. I think they're even now. The 5th largest automaker shoulda never talked ish about the then number 3 and now number 2 automaker in the world.


Money makes things happen.

mb called lexus a dressed up toyota back in 89. I think somewhere between 97 and now Lexus passed MB up in total US sales for the bland sedans. I think they're even now. The 5th largest automaker shoulda never talked ish about the then number 3 and now number 2 automaker in the world.


Money makes things happen.

Who cares about sales though? A luxury buyer could care less about sales....

Who cares about sales though? A luxury buyer could care less about sales....

You'd be surprised what people use to make decisions about the cars they buy. People respond to numbers, hence why you hear cars having the biggest V6 in its class, or that it's number 1 in sales, or that Motor Trend gave it the top rating, or that JD Power ranked it #1 in quality or whatever. And the more a person sees a car on the street, the more likely they are to think about buying it when they're ready for a new car, esp if they like the way it looks.

Who cares about sales though? A luxury buyer could care less about sales....

You'd be surprised what people use to make decisions about the cars they buy. People respond to numbers, hence why you hear cars having the biggest V6 in its class, or that it's number 1 in sales, or that Motor Trend gave it the top rating, or that JD Power ranked it #1 in quality or whatever. And the more a person sees a car on the street, the more likely they are to think about buying it when they're ready for a new car, esp if they like the way it looks.

well said, and very true

if a lot of 60k luxury cars are sold, theres probably a reason for it :)

Who cares about sales though? A luxury buyer could care less about sales....

You'd be surprised what people use to make decisions about the cars they buy. People respond to numbers, hence why you hear cars having the biggest V6 in its class, or that it's number 1 in sales, or that Motor Trend gave it the top rating, or that JD Power ranked it #1 in quality or whatever. And the more a person sees a car on the street, the more likely they are to think about buying it when they're ready for a new car, esp if they like the way it looks.

I agree with you on every point BUT sales. I know lots of friends and co-workers who have spent over 50 grand on a car and sales don't mean anything to them. If anything when spending that kind of money you want a rarer car, not one you see all the time.

You won't be seeing it anyway if it's too expensive. :P

Who cares about sales though? A luxury buyer could care less about sales....

You'd be surprised what people use to make decisions about the cars they buy. People respond to numbers, hence why you hear cars having the biggest V6 in its class, or that it's number 1 in sales, or that Motor Trend gave it the top rating, or that JD Power ranked it #1 in quality or whatever. And the more a person sees a car on the street, the more likely they are to think about buying it when they're ready for a new car, esp if they like the way it looks.

I agree with you on every point BUT sales. I know lots of friends and co-workers who have spent over 50 grand on a car and sales don't mean anything to them. If anything when spending that kind of money you want a rarer car, not one you see all the time.

i think the same as BluCam - since when did people look at slaes figures before they buy a car!?!?
If anything id want a less rare car than the higher selling cars BUT it would never ever be an influencing factor when i make my decision - what sort of amateurish car buyer would do something like that!

the average buyer always looks at sales figures. If a car doesnt sell much, people are less likely to buy it unless they have to (ie Hyundai Accent and Geo/Chevy Metros). If more people buy a car, the average buyer is likely to do so because of that car's popularity. Why else do you think Ford Taurus sells more than a Hyundai Sonata? Hyundai's got just as many dealers as a Taurus, but people see Taurus more than Sonata.

Keeping up with the Joneses, almost basic marketing, virtually basic psychology.

the average buyer always looks at sales figures. If a car doesnt sell much, people are less likely to buy it unless they have to (ie Hyundai Accent and Geo/Chevy Metros). If more people buy a car, the average buyer is likely to do so because of that car's popularity. Why else do you think Ford Taurus sells more than a Hyundai Sonata? Hyundai's got just as many dealers as a Taurus, but people see Taurus more than Sonata.

Keeping up with the Joneses, almost basic marketing, virtually basic psychology.

Did you even read this thread? Who said ANYTHING abou the average buyer????
We were talking about more expensive cars.

the average buyer always looks at sales figures. If a car doesnt sell much, people are less likely to buy it unless they have to (ie Hyundai Accent and Geo/Chevy Metros). If more people buy a car, the average buyer is likely to do so because of that car's popularity. Why else do you think Ford Taurus sells more than a Hyundai Sonata? Hyundai's got just as many dealers as a Taurus, but people see Taurus more than Sonata.

Keeping up with the Joneses, almost basic marketing, virtually basic psychology.

The sonata sells more, most likely because of things like Value or quality. I can say for certain that it is not because it sells more in the first place. Most people dont even know where to get sales figures.
Your argument IMO is so silly - people dont operate like that, why would you buy a car depending on how many it has sold? Going by that logic why would you buy a MIV golf when the MIII golf has sold so much more? I really dont think youve thought through what you are saying!

My family recently bought 4 cars, and no one checked out the sales of each one. We just liked them and bought them. It is ridiculous to buy a car just because many other ppl have them too! ! !

My family recently bought 4 cars, and no one checked out the sales of each one. We just liked them and bought them. It is ridiculous to buy a car just because many other ppl have them too! ! !

abso-bloody-luely my point

you can think its silly if you choose...i'm just a career salesman who gets most of his sales from word of mouth. I got family and friends working in marketing at GM, Ford and Toyota corporate who read the customer satisfaction surveys and market research surveys for a living, and most people buy cars based on what's popular. There are VERY FEW enthusiasts. If everybody went for quality and warranty coverage, Hyundai/Kia would be top seller in the US.

If everybody went for quality and warranty coverage, Hyundai/Kia would be top seller in the US.
Quality - Hyundai and Kia???
LLLLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOOOOOOOOOLLLLLLLLLLLLL LLLLLLLLLLLOLOLLLLLLLLL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

i'm just a career salesman who gets most of his sales from word of mouth.

This might be quite arrogant of me to say so, but i assure you that you dont.

GM, Ford and Toyota corporate who read the customer satisfaction surveys and market research surveys.

Youve just contradicted yourslef - you say how people go for satisfaction e.t.c. as opposed to meaningless sales figures.

If everybody went for quality and warranty coverage, Hyundai/Kia would be top seller in the US.

I never said everybody went for that?!?

If everybody went for quality and warranty coverage, Hyundai/Kia would be top seller in the US.
Quality - Hyundai and Kia???
LLLLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOOOOOOOOOLLLLLLLLLLLLL LLLLLLLLLLLOLOLLLLLLLLL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

true on warranty, but sure as hell not on quality :)

about car sales.. don't most ppl buy cars that are good that have reputation?

well if more ppl buy the car, it means more ppl trust it; but i guess it's not something i'd base any of my purchase's on still :wink:

LOL LOL LOL LOL, now I remember why I don't visit this forum much does anybody even read auto news at this forum? or they only go to the ferrari sites they bookmark
http://www.jdpower.com/news/releases/pressrelease.asp?ID=2004037
http://www.jdpower.com/presspass/pr/images/2004037bfull.gif
OH!!!!!! WHATS THAT! DAM! Hydunai has better quality now than BMW Mercedes, and ALL DOMESTIC AMERICAN brands

http://www.jdpower.com/presspass/pr/images/2004037cfull.gif

WOW dam their quality is bad they even beat out toyota, and they are above the industry average

:shock: :shock: :shock: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: kinda shocking, hard to believe, but this is J&D :shock: :shock:

watch, i bet people won't believe it and they'll just take it as false and make excuses. "blah blah credibility i don't believe it blah blah."

and yes i think reputation is huge with a non-enthusiast consumer. however for the enthusiast - every person on this board - we take into account uniqueness and rarity. the average buyer doesn't, and yes the average buyer includes people buying mercs and bmw's and lexus. people buying those cars i wouldn't consider enthusiasts. go to some places like Menlo Atherton (if you live in northern CA), or the OC in soCal, every car you see will be a lexus, bmw, and mercedes. ask them about their car and they will know nothing, they buy the cars b/c of prestige and populartiy. and cost. (they like to buy more expensive).

Rouin, there are some exceptions however. There are definitely ppl that buy Lexus/BMW etc and they know why they are buying it, not for prestige but because it's a good car and satisfies their driving needs. Let's not generalise saying that "all ppl who buy BMW etc do it for prestige".

About the J&D charts: is this the most inaccurate chart I've ever seen or not??
Get real... :roll:

thats true too... :?

LOL LOL LOL already denial, man it is real, just face it Mercedes and BMW aren't the greatest when it comes to quality they have a lot of problems with their electronics

I worked at a Mercedes Dealership for 2.5 years.The cars did not impress me at all as far as quality and reliability.They are beautiful cars but in my opinion not a reliable one.I am a parts man and new all the head gasket parts for a 104 motor by heart becuse we stocked 4 sets of them.They all leaked at the rear diff and electronic problems out the but.I loved it though cause I was paid on commision.I always joke and say you need to buy two Mercedes so you can drive one while the other is in the shop.

Well the japanese cars are certainly more reliable, but IMO the German cars are second only to Japanese.

well, hmmm I think I like them I like Beemers more though, I saw one go almost as fast as a Lambo, yet it had alot of **** in it, and the Lambo was just havin' some play time!!! :twisted:

I've got to admit, as much as I am a sports car enthusiast and all, I did buy my car taking reliability into consideration... if I had the money, I'd own both a Lexus AND a Benz... along with God knows how many other types of cars... as many as I could afford I guess :D but since I didn't have the money at the time that I bought my car, I chose Toyota, since I was buying an older model car and couldn't afford to repair it every month. So far, so good -- I've only had a few minor problems with it, and it's almost 15 years old... sure, it's not the fastest thing on four wheels, but it's still faster than the crap low-end Mustangs and similar cars that they're selling these days... not bad for a four-cylinder. As for sales, I don't care how many people buy a particular type of car -- because if they turn around and sell it two years later, who's to say how reliable it is? Both the Japanese and the Germans are brilliant when it comes to making cars; Japanese cars just happen to be more affordable.